| Author | Thread: Prof. Echothrice: or how I learned to stop turtling and love the golem | Page 1 | 2 |
| Echothrice Posts: 98
Location: Villuno
Magus Age: 117 years old
| Message #14353 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 5:39 am |
As it has come to the attention of all who have ever participated in wars in Muelsfell to date, there are no victory condition other then which side surrenders first. However, before this stage is reached, the losing side almost always resorts to turtling, hiding behind no-armed golems, weak abs golems, or no golem at all.
As such, I propose that when a conflict has gone on long enough, the first side that begins to turtle, as defined above, is declared the loser after a period of 3 days of this wholly undignified maneuver. Failing to maintain a reasonable guard on at least 50% of participants in the fighting will result in a defacto declaration of surrender, wherein the only remaining course of action is the discussion of the terms of the surrender.
To illustrate this point, the current war between NWO and TOMU stands as follows:
TOMU - 39333 42740 points
NWO - 25951 28165 points
All TOMU members involved in the fighting have maintained throughout the entirety of this engagement a working defense. At minimum this means a personal guard stationed outside (unless one was just destroyed), for most, a clan guard has been assigned as well. Additionally, personal walls have been continually rebuilt as destroyed to maintain optimum defensive properties.
For the last week, NWO members involved in this conflict have rarely put out anything larger then a clay, stone, or iron lvl1 golem, often with no arms, no head, and a parchment as the power source. Some members have a slightly higher level golem out, ie. a clay3, with a flesh 1 abdomen, resulting in the possibility of losing anything other then the abdomen nigh on impossible. Additionally, walls have not been constructed at all as of late.
As you might recall, this war was begun because certain members of NWO decided, repeatedly mind you, to knock through wall, personal guard, and clan guard in order to loot the members of TOMU. So at this point, NWO, mount a proper defense, or surrender.
Professor Echothrice, acting Ambassador for ToMU, on behalf of the Executive CouncilLast Edited: Oct 16, 2008, 12:15 am |
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| CommComms Posts: 392
Location: Daylsfeld
Magus Age: 121 years old
| Message #14355 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 7:20 am |
| Well, when you put it like that, clearly they have no option but to change their devious ways or surrender. How dare they not put up a fight exactly as you want them to! You're doing it all wrong NWO, and as such, your only options are now fighting "properly" or capitulating. |
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PeggaPosts: 702 Location: Jaaron Magus Age: 122 years old Clan: ADV | Message #14361 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 12:14 pm |
| Or, just have Kep set an automatic finish on the skirmish score. Any war that one side reaches 50k, 100k, pick-a-number-k; that's the winner and the skirmish ends. You can always start another one, but the scores will both start at zero. |
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| Sconibulus Posts: 664
Location: Shuul
Magus Age: 116 years old
| Message #14374 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 3:18 pm |
| Commcomms, it's just grown boring, we're rebuilding our defense golems faster than they can be destroyed, and are suffering depot overload because of it. However there's no way to hit a golem in the basement, or to drain the motivation of a foe, so there is no way to finish the job. As it stands currently we wipe each and every one who does any fighting out in short order, and they are capable of countering to destroy or disable maybe a golem or three every day, before retreating back to their sad armless shells. It's just grown boring, and there's no mechanic to end the battle. |
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| Vanishing Posts: 76
Location: Rimesvin
Magus Age: 123 years old
| Message #14380 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 4:30 pm |
| I think thats good going when you consider the numbers involved and the lack of spell system.... |
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| CommComms Posts: 392
Location: Daylsfeld
Magus Age: 121 years old
| Message #14382 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 4:48 pm |
Eh, I know what he means, and completely agree that clan warfare is rather hollow right now. Fortunately there's plans in the works to make it a detailed feature sometime in the future.
It's just that the presentation of "we think you're doing it wrong, therefor you've lost and must either start doing it right, or say the words 'I surrender', or else... things keep on going as they are." is sorta silly. Especially given that it's NWO, which has shown they don't really care what other people think.
Challenge them, make a proposition, come up with something creative. And I mean something better than "Proposition A: In which what you're doing is defined to be losing and eirgo you change it or you lose." |
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| Yamikuronue Posts: 1288
Location: Mottonsborough
Magus Age: 116 years old
| Message #14383 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 4:49 pm |
| CommComms said:
Well, when you put it like that, clearly they have no option but to change their devious ways or surrender. How dare they not put up a fight exactly as you want them to! You're doing it all wrong NWO, and as such, your only options are now fighting "properly" or capitulating.
Commcomms i love you because
when you're hard up you pawn your
intelligence to buy a drink and when
you're flush pride keeps
you from the pawn shops and
because you are continually committing
nuisances but more
especially in your own house |
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| Echothrice Posts: 98
Location: Villuno
Magus Age: 117 years old
| Message #14384 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 4:49 pm |
Regardless, as I pointed out initially, some members of NWO decided it would be fun to repeatedly wreck certain low level members of TOMU, to the point where at least one went temporarily inactive.
In other words, this was started by certain members of NWO, not TOMU, so complaining about lack of equality in clan abilities and numbers should be dismissed. |
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| Vanishing Posts: 76
Location: Rimesvin
Magus Age: 123 years old
| Message #14385 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 5:33 pm |
| who's complaining. i was bragging. :-) |
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| CommComms Posts: 392
Location: Daylsfeld
Magus Age: 121 years old
| Message #14389 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 7:03 pm |
| And I love you Yamkuronue for the shining wit, humor, and intelligence you display with every post. |
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| Echothrice Posts: 98
Location: Villuno
Magus Age: 117 years old
| Message #14392 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 7:43 pm |
Ah comms, did you miss her wit? Here's link to the original for anyone who missed the reference.
http://www.poemhunter.com/poem/humanity-i-love-you/
I just killed another golem, it was strangely unsatisfying.
Yes, I agree that clan warfare is hollow. Right now, there is no effective means of ending a war other then both sides deciding that they're done. Unfortunately, if your only goal is to rape, maim, and pillage, there's no way in hell that you'd ever want war to end.
Alright, time for some propositions then.
Proposition A: War just ends, you say you're sorry, but even though we know you don't mean it, we let you go. We all play nice, no one loses face.
Proposition B: War continues, we keep smashing you until such a time as clan warfare is completely instigated, at which point we demolish you, and your entire clan, in as short a period of time as humanly/golemly possible.
Proposition C: All agressors just poof and go inactive/nopvp. We say screw it and nothing further happens for a month.
Proposition D: War continues, we convince/bribe/threaten other clans to support a writ against NWO.
Proposition E: If Preposition D doesn't work, we repeat until NWO is no more.
Proposition F: Poseidon gets sick of your lameity and demotes you all to utter newbs, with no access to clan golems, you surrender out of shame at your noobness.
Proposition G: Act of Kep causes shakeup of the realm, in the confusion, the war just sortof ends.
Proposition H: I just had to make it this far, I'm done now.
Thoughts? Comments? Additions? Surrenders? |
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| CommComms Posts: 392
Location: Daylsfeld
Magus Age: 121 years old
| Message #14393 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 7:58 pm |
On the contrary, I didn't miss one iota of the "wit" that seems to have been slung around. Glad it missed me though, I've already taken my shower for the month.
Anyway, I personally think writs should be thrown around more than they are, so here's hoping they vote yes on Prop. D. I bet any SM would rethink their position in a hurry if it looked like a second writ was about to drop their HQ level.
There's also Proposition I: TOMU declares itself the victor, stops actively attacking NWO members and brings up their glorious victory at every opportunity. |
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| Echothrice Posts: 98
Location: Villuno
Magus Age: 117 years old
| Message #14396 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 8:25 pm |
The only problem with Prop I as you've proposed is that I've already declared victory, it's just a matter of how they want the war to end, meaning will they settle now for no repurcussions, or try dragging it out to get slammed harder down the line.
Meh, we've only ever been attacking those NWO members that attacked us. The currently 6-7 members of NWO on the list of doom are ones that when they log on, attack a few members of TOMU, stick up a worthless guard (almost all of the time), then log off again. In other words, they stop, we stop. I personally vote for A or G, preferably G. Any NWO members actively in the war care to vote/comment on this?
For clarification, stop attacking us, send us a message stating as much, and this whole mess can just fade away.Last Edited: Oct 14, 2008, 8:26 pm |
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| Haruna Posts: 471
Location: Jinkara
Magus Age: 117 years old
| Message #14397 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 8:57 pm |
Would it not be grand if we could use the points we garner in Clan Warfare to mount aatacks on the opposing Clan? With each member 'donating' a chunk of thier Motivation and a sacrifice of say... 10000-20000 points one could send a 'mob' of attack golems (Not on Defense) to go and ransack the opposing clan's HQ, doing damage to buildings and stealing resourses and maybe Clan Items? Probably not the items, but still, if a Great Hall goes down enough the clan could start losing members, starting with those contributing the least to the fight? Or maybe by seniority and rank? If a clan could get cut down like that, mayhaps Turtling would not be as great an option...
-Haruna Al Khalid |
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| Echothrice Posts: 98
Location: Villuno
Magus Age: 117 years old
| Message #14398 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 9:03 pm |
| Yeah, we're all just kindof waiting to see what sort of things Kep throws into clan warfare. Regardless, it will ideally allow interclan conflicts to be resolved, one way or another. |
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| Panacea Posts: 167
Location: Broukendale
Magus Age: 117 years old
| Message #14406 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 10:18 pm |
I find it ironic that the person I've noticed turtling from the start is complaining about NWO's turtling. And also that they act as if they haven't been turtling at all, when I'm having to go further and further out to find a TOMu that doesn't have a flesh or nothing out.
Guess that's just the alternate viewpoints kicking in.
And has anyone noticed TOMu's strategy of widely publicising every conflict they have and then lording it over everyone.
"Oh no ADV didn't reply to our message in half an hour and said I was a doodyhead, let's kill them... Oh that mean boy is attacking my boyfriend. I mean he did stop for a while when asked but he started again after my boyfriend had rebuilt his walls and golem. Let's destroy his clan."
...I may have slightly paraphrased that narrative. |
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| FatherCoyne Posts: 332
Location: Mallow
Magus Age: 116 years old
Real Name: Kevin Coyne
Email: KCoyne@umail.ucsb.edu
| Message #14409 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 11:05 pm |
It's not ironic! Nothing ironic has ever happened in this game!
Call them a hypocrite, and stop being snide.
...
You know, if you feel like it. :( |
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| Yamikuronue Posts: 1288
Location: Mottonsborough
Magus Age: 116 years old
| Message #14411 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 11:18 pm |
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"Oh no ADV didn't reply to our messages in half an hour a month and said I was a doodyhead, let's kill them... Oh that mean boy is attackingraping my boyfriend. I mean he did stop for a while 2 days when asked pleaded for the third time in a sufficiently humble manner but he started again 2 minutes after my boyfriend had rebuilt his walls and golem, and his clan declared war on us for being irked about breaking their alliance instead of bothering to talk about it with me. Let's destroy his clan."
FTFY
this message has been approved by the TOMU council |
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| Echothrice Posts: 98
Location: Villuno
Magus Age: 117 years old
| Message #14413 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 11:30 pm |
Aw, Pan, you didn't vote on which Proposition you'd like to see occur, and I worked so hard on those too. If you hadn't noticed, I have a lvl5 wood guard outside now, and a nice clan clay guard as backup. Other TOMU members that still care enough about this war to fight are Kaelas, Denerid, Shukar, and Sconibulus. Everyone else just said screw it because you're obviously only out for the xp and points, and you have nothing fun to smash anyways.
Oh, look at that, armless clay 1 with wood 1 pelvis. At least you moved away from the flesh1 pelvis. I think I'll tell everyone to let you be this time, just to point out for all who care the exact policy of NWO in this war.
Then take a look at myself, Kaelas, Sconibulus, Denerid, and Shukar. To the best of my knowledge, no one else still cares enough to continue smashing armless golems and loot pointless resources. Then take a look at the clan guards of those that are "hiding" behind lvl1 fleshies. Oh, what's that? Clan guards by every last one of them? And with all their limbs too?
Got any examples of people attacking you that don't have decent guards out? I'll smack em around myself for putting up a poor show. |
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| CommComms Posts: 392
Location: Daylsfeld
Magus Age: 121 years old
| Message #14415 Posted: Oct 14, 2008, 11:36 pm |
Don't worry man, we already established that MAGIER is the local king of irony way back when, nobody's going to take our crown from us.
And Panacea, you're exactly right! TOMU does do the publicity thing, and I can say from experience that when your clan is on the other side of it it is really annoying. But to be entirely fair there are certainly a few NWO members who have made similarly annoying and unnecessary posts in the past. I think they just have a bunch of vocal members and lack the "If you communicate with the outside world we will neuter you" rule OTAKU has.
Speaking of annoying and unnecessary posts, why am I here? I'm just undertaking a guerilla campaign to push that any such disagreements between clans be fought out by bitingly clever and fun to read articles in the newspaper.
Huh, Proposition J: Each side shall write one scathingly insulting and clever article about the other and everyone who cares should vote for which clan's is better in the form of voting yes for a writ against one of the two clans. Repeat until surrender is called for. |
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| deathpunk Posts: 154
Location: Nournsland
Magus Age: 117 years old
| Message #14429 Posted: Oct 15, 2008, 1:59 am |
| I like prop J for all clan disagreements from this point until kep gets the clan warfare up. |
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CaduceusPosts: 185 Location: Last Alvia Dawning Magus Age: 126 years old Clan: OTAKU2 Real Name: Paul
| Message #14445 Posted: Oct 15, 2008, 4:53 am |
| Echothrice said:
The only problem with Prop I as you've proposed is that I've already declared victory
"DEWEY DEFEATS TRUMAN" |
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| Panacea Posts: 167
Location: Broukendale
Magus Age: 117 years old
| Message #14454 Posted: Oct 15, 2008, 6:10 am |
Oh no my golems can't possibly stand up to the might of TOMU's organised tactics... it's a pity because that's not really meant to be sarcastic.
And now I'm going to try to suppress my male ego to actually congratulate TOMU on a well fought war. I mean I was just in it for xp and points (true statement).
I'll also apologise to those TOMU members who bothered attacking me for the turtling, it is annoying so fair call. As for the alleged cause of the war, I refuse to apologise for that as Yami's warped view of those events is far from what happened. I mean Yami, humble... please.
So for a convenient segue, I'll vote for your Proposition C echo, final exams are upon me and this game is way too addictive for me not to.
So once again congratulations to everyone except Yami, who annoys me for obscure and unjustified reasons. See you all in November. |
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HalfteaPosts: 1307 Location: Darghelm Magus Age: 133 years old Clan: ADV | Message #14473 Posted: Oct 15, 2008, 11:54 am |
| I'm all for Proposition J. Editorials would be neat. And make liaden very, very happy. :) |
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NanashiPosts: 1115 Location: Asylum Magus Age: 120 years old Clan: OTAKU | Message #14487 Posted: Oct 15, 2008, 3:12 pm |
| CommComms said:
And Panacea, you're exactly right! TOMU does do the publicity thing, and I can say from experience that when your clan is on the other side of it it is really annoying. But to be entirely fair there are certainly a few NWO members who have made similarly annoying and unnecessary posts in the past. I think they just have a bunch of vocal members and lack the "If you communicate with the outside world we will neuter you" rule OTAKU has.
*squeaky voice* I don't know what you are talking about, CommComms. OTAKU doesn't have a Incommunicato Rule, we just have to make sure Rigby is passed out from tequila, instead of simply drunk. >_>
Caduceus said: Echothrice said:
The only problem with Prop I as you've proposed is that I've already declared victory "DEWEY DEFEATS TRUMAN"
For those not in the U.S. that may not know. This is a newspaper headline that was printed back in the 1940s(?) during the presidential campaign between Dewey and Truman...we never had a President Dewey.
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